AP When a painting gels, it seems like it is much more
        than just getting it
        to "work." In a funny way it seems like it is put to
        rest on the one
        hand and set it motion on the other. That point when everything
        comes
        together and the fusion sets in and it jumps into a kind of hyperspace,
        that whoosh, and the whole thing becomes so much more than the
        sum of
        its parts that it is almost an understatement. At that point
        it is as though
        the work is out of our hands, and in that funny way, ready to
        go, like a
        child that grows up. I find that I like it when this maturation
        comes in
        the natural process of painting; however I also enjoy the challenge
        of
        finding that certain something which propels the work to that
        other level. The hardest ones are those that are so close and
        could be really great but the next
        second crash and disappear forever. Does this happen to you?
        Those
        paintings that come along and promise so much and never deliver?
        What
        happens there? I get tight, I guess. Pitching a no hitter into
        the ninth
        and then losing my focus and blowing it because the promise was
        too
        great. I would have to say t
  
hat most of my "best" paintings
        never made
        it. What about those last few moments? How do you treat a painting
        at
        that point? What sort of factors come into play? What does it
        depend on,hang on, how do we know?
        
MMWow!Where to begin.How a painting occurs and how it
        at its best can
        correspond to some truth,not absolute,just an exhilarating correspondence
        between it and some unknown part of yourself.I know the "dropping
        the ball"
        sensation to keep with your sports metaphors or striking out
        as you put it
        in the ninth.Someone said that the beauty of baseball is that
        300% in
        batting is damn good and as such corresponds to life.So the implication
        is
        that you have a lot of failures for the few successes you have.I
        was
        thinking that today in my studio that the last two days of new
        color,return
        to brushes,lots juicy paint might not gel; I thought of the waste,but
        recalled something from Robert Frost that waste is part of the
        game.Something about butterflies destroying themselves as they
        gorge
        themselves on milkweed nectar.All the little sperm that don't
        make it.
But I know
        also what you say about just feeling right about it doesn't mean
        the painting works. Often I get sort of bogus recognitions in
        my work;for
        example I'll see some contemporary philosophical principle at
        work."How
        post modern of me""This is so intersubjective"I
        can rest assured that the
        next day I'll wince at what I've done.The best work either is
        pushed over
        the long term step by step piece by piece to a point where the
        whole goes
        beyond the parts.(That is I sweat over the interrelationship
        of the
        parts,back and forth,and may find by chance that the parts begin
        to resonate
        unawares in a way that I may 
  
never have intended)(is this the
        hyperspace you
        are talking about) or having just discovered some new realm I
        can knock off
        a series of images within that mode for a few weeks..Until its
        novelty wears
        off(obviously the new mental configuration is initially pleasurable)then
        some new problem presents itself or the painting wants to be
        more.
I think that
        what I want most is the painting to be a presence that people
        will keep coming back to.I said something to that effect in response
        to
        Richard Tuttle's NYT interview.He said it was an American phenomena
        this
        need to create an intense personal presence.Not to clobber the
        viewer but to
        grab them maybe but give them so much complexity they can't let
        go.Bringing
        complexity into our visual space.He said it should not be fast
        like signage
        or ads.But I think at some level it should be fast and then slow.
I think most
        people are very clever,clever to a fault.They've got their back
        covered, they never let down their guard.I think I am easily
        mesmerized by
        the surface of things,the beauty of light,the candy in the store
        window.And
        I get burned,taken advantage of,while you are dazzled by the
        candy,someone
        is picking your pocket.Now in day to day life which is made up
        of
        deals,negotiations over territory,what's yours and mine I suppose
        one had
        best not be too naive.But in art I think it is an advantage to
        be
        susceptible,to be open,to lose boundaries.This "promesse
        du bonheur" thing I
        was talking about. It gets you into new territory like the promise
        of fertile
        and rich frontier lands for the pioneer.
APWhat about clarity of purpose, intensity, conviction?
        For better or worse,
        is obsession a must for the artist?
  
MMThose are the things you hear about as a student.At
        least I did at Yale.If
        you say that you are an artist than you must act like one.You
        got to do
        art,obviously to be an artist.I was that way especially in the
        beginning.It
        was all or nothing.Every day every event had to confirm this
        self image.I
        wasn't much fun and the girlfriend I had at that time bore the
        brunt of my
        obsessive nature.Self narrowly defined constantly needing to
        have the
        definition mirrored back.It is a trap.I was definitely an insufferable
        type.I see things differently now.Focus, clarity in art is a
        mode I can
        shift into.When I am there in the studio,I am totally there.I
        let go of it
        all when I am out of the studio.There is so much else that makes
        you an
        artist,like being an engaged human being,involved with others
        and influenced
        by one's surroundings.Eric Bogosian has a new great monologue
        which includes
        a bit on the narcissistic actor who seeks a reflection of his
        fame at every
        moment of the day; for relaxation at night he watches himself
        on TV.You
        aren't real unless you are getting that reflection. It is the
        danger of
        teaching.A built in cast of fans.
Teachers
        are like football coaches.I heard the pep talks,from my parents
        too.Self immolation is the only way to get that recognition.All
        or
        nothing,your whole life has to be in it.But you know if there
        is nothing
        else feeding you,then you dry up.You end up imposing a very narrow
        definition
        of self that boxes you in.I like to be surprised to see how I
        can
        spontaneously be redefined by my work. The "lived life"
        contradicts the
        image you had grown accustomed to. It crops up in my paintings.
AP How did you get going as an artist?
        MM As usual you ask some tough questions.My
        experience in the art world is that
        people just don't talk about the life,the struggle etc.I think
        that a lot of
        people I have worked with in academia over the years are happy
        to have a job
        in the arts and their art is just a kind of passport to that
        world.If there
        is a struggle it may be that there is a part of that world that
        is closed to
        them.A gallery,NYC,critical acclaim etc.But the struggle with
        the work,the
        split between what is and what you want never comes up.I don't
        hear that
        very often.Except from you.I remember once helping to organize
        a symposium
        at the Art Institute for a group of narrative painters.They showed
        their work
        and then talked about it.The essence of what they said was a
        long whine
        about rejection,not getting from the art world what they thought
        they
        deserved.All of that is real ,no denying,but someone asked what
        about the
        work,the joy the pain,the vision,the hope. Well your questions
        get to the
        core of it all to that inner debate and struggle that keeps us
        moving and
        creating.
I'm just
        an ordinary guy.I enjoy the different kinds of
  
        weather,landscape.(Sounds like I'm putting together an ad for
        men seeking
        woman)I get lost in my senses very easily.They are like clothing,
        a a garb
        that we cloak ourselves in.They define us.Until something catastrophic
        happens.The cloak is rent.This oscillation gets me going.
        AP What do you credit for your love of
        art, and what lead you to
        dedicate your life to it?
        MM As for
        dedicating my life to it:The seeing just happens unless you shut
        you eyes.And all that seeing,the whole environment,other art,the
        people in it has to
        be digested.I really often suffer from a sort of visual indigestion.It
        can only get processed through art.I remember having a clear
        sense of this at the end of High School>I had dedicated myself
        to academics quite successfully,beginning to master the world
        of words and their meaning when I became quite lethargic as though
        there were 18 years of images that had to get processed.At that
        point I was doomed to be an artist or else go crazy with this
        excess of visual stuff inside of me.And so it continues to this
        day.And a love 
of the language,like someone can love words. I
        like the underlying structure that keeps rising to the surface
        when I paint.
        
AP What do you think the kind of work you do has to offer
        the art community at large?
MM Thank god for other artists.Who else
        can truly the enjoy the games I play and the risks I take with
        the tradition. 
        
AP A lot of people think that twentieth
        century art will end up on the
        trash heap, if it hasn't already. What contributions do you think
        will
        last and why?
MM The severed Ear show I think established
        an interesting connection between pure abstraction a la Polk
        Smith and a more lyrical approach embodied in Joan Snyder for
        example. Abstraction was moving away from a scientific,reductive
        trope to becoming something like abstract letters that when combined
        into words can begin to open up the world of life and emotions.It
        moves out of a self reflexive mode into a life world of meaning.It
        is just beginning.I feel that I am part of it.
        
AP How does being an art educator affect you as an artist?
        What about
        your recent experiences?(optional)
MM Just as my life as an artist is based
        on all sorts of assumptions,so was my teaching.Not everybody
        wants to buy into them.I tend to think that
        as a person I am quite transparent: What I am should be clear
        to others.In fact So much is lost in translation. WE should all
        have spin doctors just to survive in academia.The most important
        thing in teaching is to remain at heart an artist,Everything
        should come out of that.That is what the students want to hear
        in any case.I think a lot of people to teach because they want
        to be needed.The student teacher feed back loop is insidious.